12 replies to this topic

[Maurice]

I have a couple of fish ponds. One which I just leave alone and let the tadpoles and frogs etc live there -- only occasionally topping up with water from the rain buts.

The other is somewhat ornamental and contained [?] some golden carp about 9" long.
Whilst away on holiday I came back to find that the water had dropped alarmingly and was only about 1/2 full.
So over the past week I have decided to clean it out -- OMG it is about 4' deep and is rock solid with plant life.
Starting by pumping the water out - via the filter - into some spare buts and also into the bottom pond!
Now to get the plants out
-- Sh*t has got nothing on the smell. and to add to the problems there seems to be half a ton of builders rubble - bricks etc on the bottom which the roots have integrated with.

Got down now to as low as I can manage from the side and lifting [pulling -struggling] the plants and weeds out.
Mary wants me to save some of the Flags and Irises etc --Hmmmmm!!

The water is a black as ink and twice as thick.. 4 wheel barrows of stuff so far. God knows what I am going to do with it.

Oh yes! we did rescue the fish and put them - for now in the small pond.
Ordered a new Kargester power spray to clean the structure.

Any one want a job !!!

Maurice

[Mister H]

Maurice,

Many moons ago I collected Koi and had a number of showfish. My experience is that although they are 'clearwater' fish, they actually prefer the dirty water as it has more bacteria.

You should avoid using tap water to clean the filters and try to reuse the old water from the pond to refill it - tap water will kill the bacteria in the pond and you will have to wait for it to mature again. If you kill all the good bacteria you might kill your fish.

I would also get a PH testing kit from a pet shop and test the water before you put the fish back if you use tap water to fill the pond.

Also, don't forget to re-introduce the fish to the new water slowly as the sudden shift in temperature can shock them.

[tony from suffolk]

The black smelly mud is very rich in nutrients, so spread it on the garden.

If the water level dropped suddenly you've probably got a hole in the liner; vigorous plants can grow through butyl rubber so unfortunately you'll have to clean the pond right out & find the hole. This can be repaired with a patch. If there're lots of holes though you'd be better of relining the pond.

Split the irises etc. & plant them in proper pond soil in planting crates, they'll very quickly re-establish.

Not sure quite what your "Golden carp" are. Maybe Golden Orfe? If so they like a lot more oxygen than goldfish so make sure you keep some oxygenating plants in the pond.

[tony from suffolk]

The black smelly mud is very rich in nutrients, so spread it on the garden.

If the water level dropped suddenly you've probably got a hole in the liner; vigorous plants can grow through butyl rubber so unfortunately you'll have to clean the pond right out & find the hole. This can be repaired with a patch. If there're lots of holes though you'd be better of relining the pond.

Split the irises etc. & plant them in proper pond soil in planting crates, they'll very quickly re-establish.

Not sure quite what your "Golden carp" are. Maybe Golden Orfe? If so they like a lot more oxygen than goldfish so make sure you keep some oxygenating plants in the pond.

[Maurice]

Thanks Ritchie,
I only fill the ponds from my rainwater.. would cost too  much to use the hose.
I do pressure wash the filters though and I will be pressure washing the pond when I have my new washer..
This is the work in progress.
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these are only half of the stones that I have taken out..
got new wellies will attack again tomorrow..

Maurice

[Mister H]

No worries. My mate owns is own Aquatics centre so if you need any advice just shout.

[Maurice]

Finally gotten down to the bottom of the pond.
My wife says it smells like the Seaside!! I think quite differently.
Taken the advice and have placed all of the black sludge in one area of the garden -- to see what happens.
All the weeds etc have gone in the Grey bin to the recycling centre..
The next thing is how to sort out the bottom of the pond.
When I finally got to the bottom  - it is cast concrete and very solid - but there is a 4" pipe that comes from the bottom to the top side of the pond - to allow water to overflow into the second pond where the pump is. It is then pumped from the second pond into a filter system and  comes back over a water fall into the first pond.
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I think that this 4" pipe should be covered with ??? something -- perhaps pebbles and gravel to be some sort of filter. [it was previously blocked solid with weed roots and sludge, and in consequence no water flowed.
I am sure that is how it should work.
Just what to put over the end of the pipe.??
I will go over to and aquatic centre this afternoon to seek some advice -- before I start filling the pond again.

The fish are still OK in the second overflow pond and hiding under the lilies etc.
Will take some photos and post before I do anything..

Maurice

[fishman]

In the dark old days some people filled the bottom of the pond with gravel, If water could flow through it it eventually became a micro climate type filter, But the big problem was you could not see what was happening and consequently it was all too easy to kill the filter which then left excess food Etc  to go rotten killing fish and so on.It is now considered a very BAD idea, Without seeing your set up in detail i would say you need some sort of mesh over the pipe to stop fish being sucked into pipe then somewhere fit an exteral filter, The size of filter depends very much on the size and type of fish you intend to keep but for say Koi carp think VERY big and VERY expensive. For very small fish or one or two goldfish you will get away with a smaller filter, Its a shame you are so far away i have all sorts kicking about or maybe i could have a look for you. When you are ready to re fill try and borrow a water meter so you know what it holds this can be a BIG help with fiter size and medicine Etc

[tony from suffolk]

fishman, on 21 June 2012 - 10:40 PM, said:

When you are ready to re fill try and borrow a water meter so you know what it holds this can be a BIG help with fiter size and medicine Etc

Damn! That's a remarkably good idea Mr Fishman! Wish I'd done it...

[toscal]

Or if you can't get a water meter, and have one fitted to the house take a reading then fill up pond and take another reading. Failing that you could time how long it takes to fill a gallon bucket and then time how long it takes to fill the pond. Then you can work out how much water is in it.
Mind you what shape is the pond.If its almost square then a simple volume calc maybe all that's needed.

[fishman]

I have a spare meter somewhere BUT its at home 60 miles away and not due for a week or two or you could borrow it with pleasure,, If you take the job seriously it may be worth buying one as Plain tap water is not good and the filter i use for the tap water has a life, So my meter records all water top ups etc, Might be worth looking on Ebay i would not think expensive just fasten to a cheap wooden home made stand and connect with hosepipe connectors.If really keen just ask search any local Koi carp clubs they are full on nice people and a mine of information and s/h gear, Try and avoid the garden centre type places a lot of them dont specialise and just want to take your money, IE most of the little plastic box type filter are a total waste of money and a filters active area  is far too small to be of any use and give you nothing but headache IE cleaning every day or so, A koi specialist is far more likely to offer sound advise. Even if you just want it for a goldfish/wildlife easy maintenance pond.
PS this is in no way a dig at Mr H who has friend with aquatic centre it is just GENERAL speaking.

[Maurice]

I don't fill the pond with mains water -- although at the moment I am doing a lot of "washing down" using a mains hose.
I normally fill the pond using rain water from  10 water buts about the garden. I do have a pump for pumping the water from the buts to the pond.
I have just [yesterday] emptied the inlet filter which is a box 65 x 55 x 45 deep this was filled with small pieces of what looked like flexible 1 1/2" conduit cut into 2" bits. I washed these ready to go back. I purchased three new filter mats that sit on top of these plastic bits [three differing grades] Also I have been advised to put a bag of crushed oyster shells at the bottom of this filter so as to regulate the Ph - as rain water has a poor Ph???

Found what needs to go on the end of the 4" clay pipe at the bottom of the pond.
It is a "Soil Balloon Grating" code 431958 in the Wickes catalogue, and over the end of that is  course black sponge filter. about 12" cube

So we are gradually getting there.

Waiting for the Kargester washer to be delivered --- said a week -- that was 10 days ago !!
Then I will pressure wash all the outside stone work.
Then fill up the first pond from the water buts and circulate the water from this pond only through the box filter to get it all settled down then move the pump into the lower pond and start full circulation. topping up as required.

What should the PH be??
The fish will not be exotic Koi -- but till we get sorted 8/10" goldfish -- as previous.

Looking forward to it!!

Maurice

[fishman]

Ideal round about 7.0 PH but if you are adding oyster shell this will alter KH or GH  which is carbonate hardness this is a buffer against PH fluctuations, So really you may be going a bit technical. Kh would need increasing if you had VERY soft water and the shell will only dissolve as req ie if acidic it will dissolve if it isnt it wont, It does however need to have water flowing over it to work, So if someone in your area recommends it fine but needs quite a large quantity in the flow of water, The PH is far more important, As far as using filtered water in your case it doesnt matter, By all means use tap water and leave a day or two before adding fish, It will be fine, Once the fish (Just a couple in a small pond) check your parameters regularly and wait for filter to mature, ( plenty reading) this is the time that things rise drastically in some cases then settle down, High ammonia can be controlled by carefull feeding and regular partial water changes eventually ammonia will settle and nitrite levels will rise then eventually settle, You then have what can be considered a mature pond,Dont throw loads of fish in till this is all settled then add slowly and watch ammonia. This is the stage where you should be carefull with top ups pump failures ETC as the filter is a living thing and it can be killed off quite easilly, Sorry if i am rambling my brain is quite old and immature now!

PS the small tube bits you mention have a very large surface are this is for growing the bacteria wich is the basis of the biofilter, Once mature this is susceptible to tap water lack of oxygen Etc and can die very quickly , But as yours is now washed start again as above.